Author Topic: Headless Fursuiters...  (Read 24008 times)

Offline Rwylin

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2013, 19:08:09 »
I pay money to go to confuzzled. I try to get some fun at the convention. And if I go out - Especially in Suit - and there are only headless people - NOT VENTING or DEHYDRATING, but drinking lots of alcohol (something what dehydrates the body), that kills the fun.

I have absolutely no problem if someone takes off his head for, as I alredy said, medical issues. I don't even mind if you take it off for rearranging anything or venting. The convention space is quite huge, why do it in public? If you start overheating, why don't you go to the Fursuit Lounge where you get air and fresh drinks for free?

For me, public headless fursuiting does not ruin the magic, it ruins the complete convention along with all photos and video recordings.

Your magic is not as important as someones health.
Security, Con staff ect are not going to go around telling suiters that they cannot take there heads off.
Also you agree with taking off head if they have a medical condition, how do you not know that all the suiters u saw do have a medical condition? or were on the verge of passing out from heat, dehydration, no food, to much drink ect.
If the con were to make this a written rule it would be to hard and to dangerous to inforce, it happens at every con so if u dont want to see headless suiters dont go to the con, we all pay to be there so the suiters have payed for the right to do as they please.
Mew =^_^=.

Offline James The Dog

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #16 on: June 04, 2013, 19:13:33 »
I admit I actually got myself feeling quite ill at one point because there was so much moaning about "ruining the magic" this year, I didn't dare take my head off outside of the lounge. I probably would have spent more time in suit if I felt I'd been able to take it off for a couple of minutes to cool off and buy a drink, rather than have to keep going back to the lounge.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2013, 19:15:27 by James The Dog »

Offline RizzoRattie

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2013, 19:27:31 »
Ultimately, at the end of the day, there is no hard or written rule about Fursuit Ettiquete, and it is down to the individual just how they wish to perform in their costume. Largely it will come down to just how that individual wishes their character to be seen.  Some people take their suit and personality very seriously and so removing the head is a huge no no. Others are just ther to enjoy the fun and escapism of suiting, and as such, taking the head off to then socialise seems perfectly fine within their viewpoint.  We of course cannot impose any restrictions on this, nor would we.  Ultimately, everyone is there to enjoy the convention in their own way, as long as it is in keeping with the rules.

Having been around in the community now since I was 18 (and I dare not tell you just how long ago that was!) I have seen many changes within the way people act in and perform in their fursuits, so it will continue to go through various life cycles.  There was a time NO one would tke their head off.  There was a time no one would lend their suit to another.  I think it is just a natural progression as more and more people get them, so will change the attitudes surrounding them.

On a fursuit note and to close my comment, some brilliant suiters this year! Really enjoyed seeing you all out and about, and thank you everyone that came along to the games, making it one of our most successful ever.

Also, 269 suiters in our parade!
Forgive me for not jumping for joy, bad back you know ~ Scar; The Lion King

Offline Tenderpaws

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2013, 19:36:36 »
I personally feel that if you’re going to spend thousands on a fursuit, wear it. So so so many times have I seen people just randomly walking around holding their head so that they can talk or drink…
Of course, you’re not required to wear the suit at all times and 100% you should remove the issue if you’re having health problems. But please bear in mind also that some people, including myself find it rather silly to see people carrying fursuit heads around. It’s not really the point of having a nice suit.
At the end of the day, everyone feels different about it and value a fursuit in different ways. I have professional mascot experience and for me, keeping the illusion alive is a very important aspect for me.
As a 28 Year old, I would not like to see a character at Disney take his character head off randomly to smoke a fag ect or to talk to people, yet I know it’s a costume. The illusion is still the magic.
In a magician show, you know that it’s impossible for something to disappear into thin air, but done correctly, you will be amazed. And that is kind of the deal with costuming.
You’re all entitled to do as you please, but please also remember that some see this as kind of pointless. Especially if it’s just because xyz.
I see the very first step out of my hotel room door in costume as a performance.

Please just bear in mind that this in my own opinion and the way I feel.

Have a good day!
Tender Paws


Offline Tenderpaws

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #19 on: June 04, 2013, 19:47:53 »
Ultimately, at the end of the day, there is no hard or written rule about Fursuit Ettiquete, and it is down to the individual just how they wish to perform in their costume. Largely it will come down to just how that individual wishes their character to be seen.  Some people take their suit and personality very seriously and so removing the head is a huge no no. Others are just ther to enjoy the fun and escapism of suiting, and as such, taking the head off to then socialise seems perfectly fine within their viewpoint.  We of course cannot impose any restrictions on this, nor would we.  Ultimately, everyone is there to enjoy the convention in their own way, as long as it is in keeping with the rules.

Having been around in the community now since I was 18 (and I dare not tell you just how long ago that was!) I have seen many changes within the way people act in and perform in their fursuits, so it will continue to go through various life cycles.  There was a time NO one would tke their head off.  There was a time no one would lend their suit to another.  I think it is just a natural progression as more and more people get them, so will change the attitudes surrounding them.

On a fursuit note and to close my comment, some brilliant suiters this year! Really enjoyed seeing you all out and about, and thank you everyone that came along to the games, making it one of our most successful ever.

Also, 269 suiters in our parade!

Ditto, Taking the head off was something that, if you did it.. People would ask what was wrong years ago.
And yes! Some excellent suiters and performers this year!

Tender Paws

Offline Aurocard

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #20 on: June 04, 2013, 19:59:11 »
I know i'm a newbie to the con, but I'm no stranger to fursuiters or being in one. I've never had one of my own, but I had a friend who would lend me his head and paws a couple of times whenever we'd go out somewhere for a meet. And I have to say, despite it being a partial, the head and arm/paws got incredibly hot (California weather...huzzah). Every fur meet, we would all spend about two/three hours in our suits and then we'd go to take a break. If there were children around, we'd keep them on, then we'd go somewhere where we could take them off away from the children. However, if it got too hot, or if something occurred, the "Illusion" or the "magic"...or..what not...would not matter. People are more important than keeping up appearances.

At this con, which was the most incredible thing I had ever seen when it came to gathering furries....I saw people with heads off, with suits down to the waist, and you know what? It didn't matter to me. It was a very warm week, everyone needed to be comfortable, everyone needed to be healthy. If a written rule was put in place, I think it would put a LOT of people off, and those that still wanted to go to the con would feel a bit restricted when it comes to their own inner character being forced to remain on even when in the most uncomfortable situations.

Look on the bright side, everyone kept their suits on during the parade ;)

-Auro
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Offline Snackcat

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #21 on: June 04, 2013, 22:01:05 »
I'm going to break the popular trend and say I am Pro-keeping your head on. I can't help but feel the whole "we know they're just people in suits" counter argument is missing the point a little. YES we know, but we like to forget that and imagine, I find a lot of people are also very brash and cold when defending taking off their heads. A lot of people at CF seem to have this "Don't give a damn" attitude, which goes against the fandom and its general outlook, the outlook it was founded on,

Here's my two cents on the matter.

I've chatted to several furs in America and I get the evidence that it's more strictly enforced over there, many people, both high up and low down respect the idea of keeping up the illusion, People such as Uncle Kage and other noteworthy furs teach this practice to people in "first con" panels and such. So if they can do it, and have (to my knowledge) never had any adverse problems, why can't we? Confuzzled is slowly becoming one of those major cons on par with AC and EF, let's try to be more like them in terms of respecting classic furry ideals.

The argument that people will get hot and tired? I think it's fairly easy to know when you need a break. I know from experience as a fursuiter that you can get carried away, but that's one reason we have handlers and spotters, also the fandom is full of helpful furs, a simple "fanning" or "time out" hand gesture can let people know you need help to the lounge.

As for the "We know" attitude, as I said, yes we DO know, but what's the point of reality if you can't pretend? I know the current generation of furs is more detached from the spiritual aspect of the fandom, but there are still many furs, greymuzzle or otherwise that are more classically minded, and do you really want to cause a friction in a fandom devoted to acceptance and co-operation? I say that not to threaten, but to warn.

Offline yagfox

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #22 on: June 04, 2013, 22:09:18 »
Heads on = performing.

Heads off = not.

I find people with heads on who are not making an effort to perform, far more irksome than those with heads off taking a breather or having a chat! :)

But I'm not going to force my views on anybody, do what you like and take from it what you want, I like to keep my head on and try to perform, because then loads of people take my picture and I feel speshul! ;)

Offline Vector

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2013, 22:17:28 »
I can say that I've never seen so many headless fursuiters before this edition of CfZ.  >:(

It was kinda depressing to be surrounded by headless people when you try to perform....and you may think it doesn't ruin the magic, but it's ruined tons of pics & videos rushes for sure.

About the weather : it was very windy and not very warm (unlike last year or any other con like Eurofurence in summer) and inside the venue it was VERY cold.
In few words, PERFECT conditions for fursuiting.

A lot of new fursuiters attended this year for sure, but before performing get some training or don't wear it. A fursuit is not a mandatory to attend to a furry convention.

Offline Bob Drake

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2013, 22:27:10 »
I'd never do it unless I was suddenly taken seriously ill, which has fortunately never happened yet! When I do see someone strolling around in public places with their head off, I'm not "disturbed" or horrified etc. It's just one of those things I wouldn't want to do. Also, on a completely practical level, when I take my head off I look like such a complete wreck with smeared eye makeup and plastered with sweat, with deep crinkles embedded in my flesh from the close-fitting head, I wouldn't want to appear in public looking like that!

Maybe part of the "problem" of headless fursuiters is connected with the idea that we are all supposed to be obligatory public entertainers and portray a character in a certain sort of way. Not every fursuiter is there strictly to entertain others. It's certainly a bonus if somebody likes my suit and enjoys looking at me in it, and I can certainly be a spontaneous show-off as anyone who has seen me at the dances can attest to. Personally I'm there in my fursuit because I enjoy it so much and love being a part of the whole thing, looking like a critter I've imagined all my life, and presume everyone else has their own reasons.

Interesting topic!

Offline Rwylin

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #25 on: June 04, 2013, 22:32:30 »
I can say that I've never seen so many headless fursuiters before this edition of CfZ.  >:(

It was kinda depressing to be surrounded by headless people when you try to perform....and you may think it doesn't ruin the magic, but it's ruined tons of pics & videos rushes for sure.

About the weather : it was very windy and not very warm (unlike last year or any other con like Eurofurence in summer) and inside the venue it was VERY cold.
In few words, PERFECT conditions for fursuiting.

A lot of new fursuiters attended this year for sure, but before performing get some training or don't wear it. A fursuit is not a mandatory to attend to a furry convention.

were u at the same con as it was bloody hot for me and alot of other people inside and out.....and i wasnt even in suit
Mew =^_^=.

Offline djem

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #26 on: June 04, 2013, 22:39:08 »
Headless fursuiter ... big topic I gess, but it's a personal thing I would never walk around in public without a head, and if urgent, just try to find a small corner to do so, away from public view.

What I would say : if you are dead and sweating, I think it would be better to first get a shower before starting to have a drink at the bar ...

Offline Vector

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #27 on: June 04, 2013, 22:43:39 »
17°C to 19°C in the afternoon is not really hot with that really windy conditions. I was even shivering sometimes at the end of the day (in fursuit or not).  

I experimented at EF no wind & 25°C to 35°C : you really need to go to fursuit lounge frequently in these conditions.

Offline Snow-wolf

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #28 on: June 04, 2013, 23:00:29 »
Actually the problem I see is not who is right or who is wrong but its cultural.

I talked to many dutch, french and german Furries, ALL of them agreed they didnt like the fursuiters that were walking around headless. (since I'm German, I share this pov, I'm sorry)
Then I actually also saw a lot opinions of british furs... and they ALL were fine with walking around headless.

So I guess there needs to be more understanding on both sides instead of blaming. I'm quite sure none of the two "sides" wants to be offensive... it's just different countries with different opinions.


Offline Dhary Montecore

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Re: Headless Fursuiters...
« Reply #29 on: June 04, 2013, 23:38:17 »
Due to the obligations of my role on this convention, I am forced to splitt my reply to this into two seperate parts.

First, I'll answer officially for the security of ConFuzzled:

There can not and will not be a written rule, that a fursuiter may not take off his head in public. However, since a large number of attendees (suiters and non-suiters) felt geniuely disturbed by the unusually high amount of fursuiters that ran around headless without a valid reason, we will focus more on this point during beginner-panels and most likely there will be a guideline for fursuiters hanging out in the headless-lounges. Thank you for keeping this discussion polite!

Now I'd like to state my personal opinion. The following does NOT represent the opinion of ConFuzzled ltd. or any convention department!

Back in the days, there was this unwritten rule, that fursuiters never take their head off in public. That's why the headless-lounge is called headless-lounge. This is why there are rules, that allow fursuiters to run around without a badge. That's why we protect their anonymity. I'm a bit offended by people that play the "medical issue card" on this problem, since nobody would ever even get to the idea to deny someone with a medical problem (overheating, dehydration, etc.) taking his head off in public.

All the complaints were about people taking their head off without any reason at all. If you have a medical problem, you don't sit down at the bar and get drunk. Also you don't walk into the restaurant and eat a full meal in a half pulled-down fursuit. Or smoke in fursuit. That's just not what the majority of our community accepts. At many conventions, this would be softly enforced to be honest. I don't see a reason for a written rule about this, but I also don't understand those few suiters that seem to think of this to be perfectly fine. If many of those I spend a convention with tell me, they don't want to see that in public, isn't it a bit arrogant to say "I don't give a f***"? Sure as hell it should make you think.

One of the suggestions regarding the reason for such a unusual large number was, that we had a lot of first timers, and since we live in a time in which every beginner can afford at least a simple fursuit, many walked around without any experience or background knowledge.

I think that might be part of the reason. All I can say is, that in all my years at conventions I've never seen so many headless suiters in public. (Without medical reason :p) And yes, that ruined a lot of photos and videos, because you may not care how you look without your head on, but most suiters do and their photos will be ruined if there are headless suiters in the background.

Last but not least: of course it's your choice what you do with your fursuit, but the furry community is based on the "we", and not on the ego of a few.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2013, 01:25:10 by Dhary Montecore »